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The official online community of New York Times best-selling author Ted Dekker.
When America Fails...
...And the nation you live in adopts a foreign, religious law... Does not protect those who seek protection... Refuses to act when it matters most...
This discussion, while spurred by the issue of Rifqa Bary, is not solely about her-- That discussion can be found HERE. Rather, this is meant to discuss the prevailing mindset behind the decision to send her back to Ohio and the appropriate response to that mindset, and others like it.
What should we do, first as Christians, then as Americans, when out justice system backs the very radicalism we supposedly are opposing?
It is not just Rifqa Barry. There have been countless others who sought protection through our legal system, our Constitution, and our government. In response, most of these people, the majority women, have been placed BACK into potentially dangerous situations without so much as a backwards glance.
Most of them have wound up dead.
With this in mind, what do we do? What can we do? Is there anything we can do in addition to prayer?
What seems to be happening here is a lack of desire or motivation to address anything that is wrong. You hit your wife? That's absolutely out of the question-- Unless your wacko religion allows it, AND you are not white. Then, we'll just turn our heads.
Is this yet another form of the wussification of America?
Martin Luther King Jr. advocated rebellion, peaceful rebellion, in the face of massive injustice. Is such a rebellion needed today? How many issues could be brought to national awareness with such action?
Malcolm X is reported to have said at one time that we should do our best to live at peace with our fellow man, but if he strikes us, we must strike back. Is a more forceful demonstration needed to wake America from it's ever deepening Sissy-hood?
As Christians, however, are there any issues with protesting, rebelling or striking out? The Bible tells us to obey the government, except when it crosses the law of God. Has it yet? What is the line? Where does it lie, and just how many would be willing to take action once that happens?
Anyhow-- My opening monologue is done. Floor's open.
This discussion, while spurred by the issue of Rifqa Bary, is not solely about her-- That discussion can be found HERE. Rather, this is meant to discuss the prevailing mindset behind the decision to send her back to Ohio and the appropriate response to that mindset, and others like it.
What should we do, first as Christians, then as Americans, when out justice system backs the very radicalism we supposedly are opposing?
It is not just Rifqa Barry. There have been countless others who sought protection through our legal system, our Constitution, and our government. In response, most of these people, the majority women, have been placed BACK into potentially dangerous situations without so much as a backwards glance.
Most of them have wound up dead.
With this in mind, what do we do? What can we do? Is there anything we can do in addition to prayer?
What seems to be happening here is a lack of desire or motivation to address anything that is wrong. You hit your wife? That's absolutely out of the question-- Unless your wacko religion allows it, AND you are not white. Then, we'll just turn our heads.
Is this yet another form of the wussification of America?
Martin Luther King Jr. advocated rebellion, peaceful rebellion, in the face of massive injustice. Is such a rebellion needed today? How many issues could be brought to national awareness with such action?
Malcolm X is reported to have said at one time that we should do our best to live at peace with our fellow man, but if he strikes us, we must strike back. Is a more forceful demonstration needed to wake America from it's ever deepening Sissy-hood?
As Christians, however, are there any issues with protesting, rebelling or striking out? The Bible tells us to obey the government, except when it crosses the law of God. Has it yet? What is the line? Where does it lie, and just how many would be willing to take action once that happens?
Anyhow-- My opening monologue is done. Floor's open.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Cassondra on -
Unless your wacko religion allows it, AND you are not white. Then, we'll just turn our heads..
Yup. Because if you are not white, you deserve recompense for the years of abuse our white ancestors used to give you a hundred years ago. Now you get to be the abusers!
The truth is, though, that no one is going to protest like MLK or Malcolm X. If we're not too busy dealing with our own problems to deal with the problems of others, we're either too lazy or we don't care.
Also, so far it's just turning our heads for them. Eventually we will turn our heads for all evil, the AntiChrist will rise, and Jesus will come back (not necessarily in that order.)
Ok, so I'm feeling a bit fatalistic. But actually, Jesus coming back is a GOOD thing. Really.
***
Yeah, this is a struggle for me. It's like asking what to do if we lived in Hitler's time. Because we are supposed to obey the authorities God has placed over us. But did God really place Obama and Hitler in power?
My friend and I were discussing something, and he mentioned that authority can be different than just power. Meaning authority is ordained by God. Power is just obtained. I don't know that I agree with him, but it is food for thought.
I suppose you may want some practical responses, other than just fatalism.
We live in a democracy (well, a republic, but really...). That means WE are the authorities God has put in place. I think, as citizens, we have certain responsibilities, and kowtowing to socialism and evil is not one of them. Meaning that just because someone...unChristian... is in power doesn't mean we aren't the ones God has ordained to do His will.
You mentioned praying... I would add speaking to the situation and Satan, prophesying to them and telling them where they can go.
I also think that if Christians were united and not split into so many factions themselves we might become a force to be reckoned with...instead of having to reckon with forces all the time. But I have no idea how to untie Christendom, practically, so maybe it's time for me to shut up.
Love in Christ,
Cassie
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Permalink Reply by Taliesin on -
"Yup. Because if you are not white, you deserve recompense for the years of abuse our white ancestors used to give you a hundred years ago. Now you get to be the abusers!"
Um, you do realize that this particular case is not dealing with black people right? It's a little ironic that that's the first conclusion you jumped to when reading that...
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Permalink Reply by Cassondra on
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I wasn't talking about black people... O.o
As far as I know, this case is about middle eastern Muslims living in America.
The modern mindset is that white is wrong, and all other colors were abused at some point in their history by the evil imperialist whites. (At least that's what I was taught in schools.) If it wasn't slavery for the blacks, it was the Native American reservation system. Or the imperialism/colonialism. Or whatever. I'm not saying that all those things were right or done right, but that was hundreds of years ago. I think it is time to move on.
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Permalink Reply by Taliesin on
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I do not, nor have ever heard of any time in American history where we abused or allegedly abused Muslim people a hundred years ago.
Unless of course you are saying that Iraq and Afghanistan were a hundred years ago...
Wow how time flies.
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Permalink Reply by Cassondra on
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Ah, but if you want to go back into imperialism/colonialism, the evil British took over India! Heck, the evil British are what became America.
And I really don't think Iraq or Afghanistan are a case of evil whites abusing the poor oppressed Muslims.
Iraq and Afghanistan: we were so evil for going in there! How dare we stop Saddam's genocides or the Taliban.
Darfur: We are so evil for not going in there! How dare we not stop the genocides!
I am not ashamed...nay, I am PROUD...to be white. And I'm sick of people telling me I shouldn't feel this way.
Though this is getting OT, I think.
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Permalink Reply by Taliesin on
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Iraq and Afghanistan these are why I used the word allegedly.
I don't think many people equate Britain and America, considering we fought for our independence -from- Britain as we were one of those colonies they exercised imperialism on. No, we get a break from everything Britain did cause of that.
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Permalink Reply by RETS on -
Sadly, there are many Muslims that to this day hold any westerner responsible for several atrocities-- The Crusades being among those still.
However, as Cass said, this is going off topic, and she was right to start off with. Caucasian means great evil in many minds, not just here in the US but around the world as well.
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Permalink Reply by living sacrifice on -
But did God really place Obama and Hitler in power?
Hm, I'm not really sure those two are quite comparable.
I don't think most of the world sees caucasian as evil either, at least not in my experience. There are many who see America as ignorant and maybe a bit imperialistic and warmongering, but most wouldn't go so far as to categorize all caucasians, or even all Americans as evil. I even know some Christians who are definitely less than fond of America, but that has nothing to do with whiteness. It has to do with politics.
It may be an American sentiment that white is bad, but I don't think its around the world. In most of East Asia (which covers a good third of the world population) white is good. The whiter the better in fact.
Whether its right or not, courts always tend to favor the parents, and many times the decision they make is wrong. I don't necessarily agree with the decision, but I don't think it has a whole lot to do with the fact that they are Sri Lankan.
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Permalink Reply by RETS on
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Well, you notice I didn't say "most of the world." I just said you can find that sentiment around the world, not just here.
Back to the subject at hand, though-- How do we deal with abortions of justice and the mindset that supports such events?
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Permalink Reply by Deb on -
Pray they are born again.
There have been countless others who sought protection through our legal system, our Constitution, and our government.
Can you see Jesus missing from this equation - without Him we can do nothing. We could have rallies and protests and rave about injustice yet unless men's hearts are redeemed our efforts would only be bandaids.
Martin Luther King Jr acheived a great deal and how would he respond to the state of affairs today?
The Gospel must come first yet not many of us are willing to be open about Christ. As in the book of Acts, they were meant to go into all the world and they hung back in Jerusalem until Stephen was stoned and a great persecution begun.
Maybe the coming sense that Obama's policies will incite more persecutions of Christians could be a very good thing indeed.
When the crowds see people who are willing to die for what they believe in hearts are changed, the gospel explodes and people are saved. Is that not their most desperate need?
Only one life,
’Twill soon be past;
Only what’s done
for Christ will last.
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Permalink Reply by RETS on
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Deb said:Can you see Jesus missing from this equation
I can see that in some cases. However, there are cases where these future murder victims have already turned to Christ, which is the very reason they are seeking protection from the law of the land.
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Permalink Reply by Paradox on -
I think the idea that this represents some deepening trend is a misleading one. From a legal perspective this seems to be very similar to the Dred Scott case. So basically it's nothing new. The specifics may be a little different, but the result does not to me to appear to be the cause of any sort of "wussification."
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